fake

a lie

and tibbs has hairy feet

HELPING?

For the particular benefit of Chris, who needs educating. (Note: These are only my opinions, but my opinions are the right ones.)

(Unlike Chris'.)

Holmes (original book canon): Gay romantic asexual.

Holmes (Granada adaptation): Gay romantic asexual.

WHU? I fail to recall that.

Evidence?

Sherlock (BBC): Gay romantic asexual.

Holmes (2009 film): GAY.

EVIDENCE

Watson (original book canon): Predominantly heterosexual. Probably looks upon his relationships with men as strong romantic friendships.

Watson (Granada): Predominantly heterosexual, Holmes being the only notable exception to this.

He's married!

John (BBC): Heterosexual, with the exception of his feelings for Sherlock.

He and Holmes are buds, but its never sexualisedor even given to much tension.

Next you'll be telling me Pulo and Varenus are gay.

(Oscar Wilde was married. He had two sons with his wife. Being attracted to men and women aren't mutually exclusive.)

(I can give you some examples of romanticised male friendship in the Victorian era...?)

(Although I don't think Doyle intended it as such, that's just the way it comes across to me.)

(Don't worry, I won't touch Pulo and Vorenus. Although I know people who would!)

Evidence of this?

Watson (2009 film): Mostly gay, but bisexual.

I would - its not gay, but pulo looks like he's made of chocolate.

What bits?

What proves or even suggests that.

Irene Adler (all canons): Raving bisexual.

No problem there, but again, evidence?

Mary Morstan (all canons): Gay, with the exception of her feelings for Watson. Still doesn't particularly like male bits.

Don't even ask me about that one. I JUST DECIDED IT, OKAY?

o..k

Who else should I do...?

hur hur

Mrs Hudstone

I'm sure you can think of something.

Lestrade (original book canon): Gay for Gregson! Probably self-loathing. Probably into mild sado-masochism.

Lestrade (BBC): Would probably like a nice quiet life with a wife and a family. May have slept with Sherlock/Sally/Anderson.

Your deliberatly ignoring everything i say arn't you!

You hate me as much as my mother.

Mrs. Hudson (original book canon): Has never been particularly bothered one way or another. Probably happier with women.

Mrs. Hudson (BBC): Heterosexual. Experimented a little in her younger days.

Fish and caltrops - see i can say stupid things too.

I don't ignore everything you say! Sorry, I was just trying to get it all written down. Any questions, class?

What is your evidence for any of this?

Well, where do I start? For the books, there's the fact that Watson's relationship with Holmes is the only lasting one in his life.

Men make strong attachments, thats not abnormal or in any way sexual. Women make the same sort of connections too.

He marries at least twice, but both times he ends up again living with Holmes. Although he's upset at Mary's death, it in no way compares...

to his reaction to Holmes' 'death'.

Does not mean he is gay.

Holmes is perhaps easier to argue for. Watson often comments on his 'abhorrence' of women. Yet, he likes Mary and considers Irene one of...

Ah, many men are masogionists or simply scared of women or have been hurt in strange ways by them. They go on to lead completly sexless

lives.

the finest minds he's ever faced. He also dismisses love as a distraction. But his friendship with Watson crosses a lot of borders that...

he claims to be unnecessarily emotional. For example, when Watson marries Mary he turns to cocaine and his obsession with Moriarty...

becomes ever more self-destructive.

But I don't think Holmes is a mysoginist. He admits to admiring many women he meets. And I do think he is asexual.

Well, looks like we have ourselves a mexican stand off.

'cept we ain't got no damned mexicans

This is all just what I take from what I read. I think he's a romantic asexual - he can fall in love, but isn't interested in sex.

...BUT HOW CAN WE DO THIS WITHOUT MEXICANS? D:

Well, i can agree with that from my own reading, but i would never consider his relationship with any of his supporting cast a gay one.

Soon, tibbs, soon...

I don't retract my statement about your feet however.

THE BBC VERSION ON THE OTHER HAND. To argue for gayness in that, I need only show you this clip:

Ah yes, the aweful series.

And I say that with the heaviest of hearts, because if this Sherlock were real I WOULD BE ON THAT.

I put that series on the same scale as Merlin and that appauling Robin Hood series.

You see, I don't mind the comment about my feet. It's completely true. I'm like a hobbit, I have to shave 'em.

awww, thats actually sort of sweet

peter Jackson recruited you for a Hobbiton extra yet?

No! I would make such a great hobbit.

I have no idea what you look like so i cannot comment

I'd be a wicked dwarf! Grrrrrrrrrrrrr axe you in the face!

Um, well, you can *kind* of see me in this picture... www.plurk.com/p/454kr4

That's the only amount of my face any human can safely view.

I don't know what you look like either, but Jessie says that you used to look like a Viking, so that sounds good for a dwarf!

it be offensive if i say you look like a twelve year old?

Alas, my long Samson esk hair and beard are gone now, but I make up for that in other areas.

Just realised how that sounded

good grief.

...You're really good at metalwork?

Hmm, I won't take offense at that. I can think of ten more offensive things to say about my looks.

But you've labelled at least one person you don't know a paedophile.

Whu?

Its not that i think you look bad, just young

By saying I look like a twelve-year-old! I'm twenty-three, just so you know.

your not unpretty, you

you know i can tell when i'm digging myself a hole - my dwarfiness compensation

Ha ha ha, shall I help you out by changing the subject?

YES

What are your opinions on wind farms?

VERY NICE

Actually, they cost more energy in the longrun than they gain.

The cost of manufacture, building, servicing and then in twelve years time they get replaced.

That's very interesting. Do you think we would be better off harnessing different kinds of energy? From the sea, perhaps?

...I'm really not sure how long I can talk about renewable energy.

I would like to pop in to recommend an essay called "Decoding the Subtext."

Me either, although i could give it a try.

Ok, what you rping atom?

it breaks down Doyle's text really well, providing near-irrefutable evidence of their relationship! yay!

There is no actual evidence given - only suposition and suggestion.

Not to impeech your opinions tibbs.

Wow, thank you for that. I'm always happy when I find good discussion and analysis of the books.

it's very, very long--I never did get through all of it

GGRRRRR

and honestly, I think there's really nothing in the books to suggest holmes is straight, or anything but asexual

we shouldn't assume he is just because that's the supposed norm

I agree. I can understand arguments against Holmes and Watson's homosexuality, but you cannot take heterosexuality as a given.

And Victorian subculture was varied but often very much under the surface.

A book is a three way conversation between the author, the text and the reader. Each one can have different opinions. Grunt.

Doyle could have been painting portraits of characters with varying sexualities without being conscious of it, in a way.

I personally hate heteronormativity, as one calls it, because it makes people assume *I'm* straight!

harrumph. I'm the head queer in charge, THANK YOU

And I'm sure the next special snowflake feels the same.

I can't speak to doyle's mindset when he was writing, but I feel your interpretation there is correct, Tib

It's such an awful term "heteronormativity". I think people's sexuality is often the most complex thing about them.

it's such an awful thing, really

oh, I'm not a snowflake. just a queer.

The way they deal with it is, both aweful and amazing.

also, the author of "decoding the subtext" has a really charming habit of pointing out every time watson uses the outdated "ejaculted"

tongue-in-cheek and rather amusing...to me, anyway.